My annual rant

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My annual rant

Postby SLAYER666 » Thu Oct 09, 2014 12:40 pm

Your 2015 RRHOF nominees:

http://www.98rock.com/onair/shroom-3237 ... d-12846043

No Iron Maiden
No Judas Priest
No Deep Purple
No Ronnie James f'n Dio

RRHOF eat a bag of dicks.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby cheapseats » Thu Oct 09, 2014 1:37 pm

Everything is based on the assumption that the HoF is a popular music hall of fame that includes dance, blues, jazz and rap.

The Paul Butterfield Blues Band - no. The HoF probably doesn't need too many harmonica players, a white one who also did fusion jazz probably doesn't need to be one of them.
Chic - yes. Nile Rodgers should be in the Hall. Don't really care how you make that happen.
Green Day - no. pop punk doesn't need a representative even if they have had a good career and some solid songs
Joan Jett & the Blackhearts - yes. though I'd probably go with the runaways instead so you get Lita Ford as well.
Kraftwerk - yes. one of the 5 most influential musical groups of all time. embarrassing that they're not in.
The Marvelettes - duh. already have the Supremes, Martha and the Vandellas, the Shirelles, the Ronettes. Is there a requirement to add a motown girl group every 5 years?
N.W.A - yes. but where the fuck is bambataa?
Nine Inch Nails - tweener. tough call. reznor mainstreamed industrial, but skinny puppy, ministry & KMFDM were all there first and throbbing gristle was their grandaddy.
Lou Reed - duh. if they had any sense they'd backdate this one and pretend that he's been there since 1990
The Smiths - tweener. some great albums and hugely influential, but only if the induction ceremony features johhny marr sitting in with warlock pinchers playing morrisey rides a cockhorse. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z20UYhP8vIQ
The Spinners - no. see marvelettes and substitute the 3 times longer list of all male groups
Sting - no. the police made reggae safe for white people and he did the same with jazz as a solo artist. hell of a musician though.
Stevie Ray Vaughan - duh. See Lou Reed, multiply by 1000.
War - yes. the merger of jazz, funk, rock with musicians of ever race on the planet was unique and hugely influential
Bill Withers - yes. how is he not already there?
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Re: My annual rant

Postby Hoosier Fan » Thu Oct 09, 2014 3:13 pm

Mostly all of the above and Warren Zevon.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby elprof » Fri Oct 10, 2014 2:27 am

The Paul Butterfield Blues Band - No. Just no.
Chic - Yes.
Green Day - Yes.
Joan Jett & the Blackhearts - Hell yes.
Kraftwerk - Never heard of them.
The Marvelettes - Nope.
N.W.A - Fuck yeah.
Nine Inch Nails - Double fuck yeah.
Lou Reed - Fuck yeah infinity.
The Smiths - Not quite.
The Spinners - Nope.
Sting - Yeppers.
Stevie Ray Vaughan - Affirmative
War - Nah.
Bill Withers - Double yeppers.

And...

Iron Maiden - Nope
Judas Priest - Nope
Deep Purple - Fuck Yes
Ronnie James f'n Dio - Nope
Virtually everything GOP critics have told us would follow from the policies put in place has not come to pass. You would think that this would occasion a few mea culpas, some rethinking, an admission of poor prognostication. But, alas, it continues.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby H.A. » Fri Oct 10, 2014 10:41 am

If they nominated Kraftwerk, then anyone who ever made noise at all deserves a nomination.

I once dropped a camera tripod down some wooden stairs. If someone had recorded that, I would be more deserving than fuggin Kraftwerk.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby cheapseats » Thu Nov 20, 2014 9:01 pm

That's einsturzend neubauten
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Re: My annual rant

Postby Joe Sieve » Thu Nov 20, 2014 10:37 pm

cheapseats wrote:Everything is based on the assumption that the HoF is a popular music hall of fame that includes dance, blues, jazz and rap.

Kraftwerk - yes. one of the 5 most influential musical groups of all time. embarrassing that they're not in.



5 most influential musical groups of all time??1?1?

Image


Have listen to the synthesizer work on Dark Side of the Moon (which was recorded before anybody ever heard of Kraftwerk, except maybe their moms) and tell me who was influencing whom. Aside from that, they kinda suck - I dare you to put that shit on shuffle and try to listen for more than half an hour. You are supposed to be in the HOF for being good, or at least popular as you pointed out - not being influential. Kraftwerk was neither.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby cheapseats » Fri Nov 21, 2014 5:57 pm

Just because YOU hadn't heard of them hardly means they weren't influential. I'd imagine both listened to each other's work, since they were contemporaries. But Kraftwerk had released 4 albums (counting proto-Kraftwerk Organisation) before Dark Side of the Moon was released.

As for influences, Organisation's Tone Float and Floyd's Piper at the Gates of Dawn 2 year's earlier were both clearly influenced by the sound collages of Pet Sounds and Revolver. But PF's early influence was R&B, while Kraftwerk were into atonal classical in german cinema and early 20th century classical music (no lyrics through 3 albums, and never a guitar on any recording).

So I'll let you decide who influenced who on Dark Side of the Moon. I AM willing to bet that Autobahn, that came after DSotM was more commercial (at least for an album that opens with a 22 minute song) and successful (#5 album in the US) because of the commercial success of PF and it changing audiences tastes.
Last edited by cheapseats on Fri Nov 21, 2014 7:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby cheapseats » Fri Nov 21, 2014 6:27 pm

Joe Sieve wrote:
cheapseats wrote:Everything is based on the assumption that the HoF is a popular music hall of fame that includes dance, blues, jazz and rap.

Kraftwerk - yes. one of the 5 most influential musical groups of all time. embarrassing that they're not in.



5 most influential musical groups of all time??1?1?

Image



Without Kraftwerk, electronic music - house, techno, electro never happens, hiphop is much different if it explodes at all. Flip on the radio today, do you hear music that was influenced by Kraftwerk or Pink Floyd?

Name 5 more influential.

Kraftwerk: the most influential group in pop history?
- http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/musi ... story.html
Tracing Kraftwerk's enduring influence - http://www.dw.de/tracing-kraftwerks-end ... a-17025532
Who sampled - http://www.whosampled.com/Kraftwerk/
Cultural Studies: Why Kraftwerk’s influence is pervasive in pop, from Bowie to New Wave, and Kanye West to Arcade Fire - http://arts.nationalpost.com/2014/03/30 ... cade-fire/
Why Kraftwerk are still the world's most influential band - http://www.theguardian.com/music/2013/j ... -band-tate
Kraftwerk's 'Trans Europe Express' started the musical revolution - http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/mu ... story.html
The Best Hip-Hop Songs Sampling Kraftwerk - http://www.laweekly.com/westcoastsound/ ... -kraftwerk
Dr. Dre Says He's Listening To Kraftwerk, Parliament Funkadelic - http://www.hiphopdx.com/index/news/id.1 ... funkadelic
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Re: My annual rant

Postby elprof » Fri Nov 21, 2014 8:01 pm

Their American cheese slices are pretty boss.
Virtually everything GOP critics have told us would follow from the policies put in place has not come to pass. You would think that this would occasion a few mea culpas, some rethinking, an admission of poor prognostication. But, alas, it continues.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby Joe Sieve » Fri Nov 21, 2014 9:02 pm

cheapseats wrote:Just because YOU hadn't heard of them hardly means they weren't influential. I'd imagine both listened to each other's work, since they were contemporaries. But Kraftwerk had released 4 albums (counting proto-Kraftwerk Organisation) before Dark Side of the Moon was released.

...



I've heard of them plenty, thanks. No way they are one the top 5 most influential bands. No way. Not popular, not good. By your own standard (which didn't say anything about "influential"), the don't belong.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby Cortez the Killer » Tue Nov 25, 2014 12:40 pm

cheapseats wrote:

Without Kraftwerk, electronic music - house, techno, electro never happens, hiphop is much different if it explodes at all.


are you trying to make people hate them?
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Re: My annual rant

Postby elprof » Tue Nov 25, 2014 12:45 pm

Some of their stuff is available for free on Amazon Prime. I listened to maybe 8 tracks and found one to be tolerable.

The rest were appropriate for the time on Sprockets when we dance.
Virtually everything GOP critics have told us would follow from the policies put in place has not come to pass. You would think that this would occasion a few mea culpas, some rethinking, an admission of poor prognostication. But, alas, it continues.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby juansamuel » Tue Nov 25, 2014 3:23 pm

Cortez the Killer wrote:
cheapseats wrote:

Without Kraftwerk, electronic music - house, techno, electro never happens, hiphop is much different if it explodes at all.


are you trying to make people hate them?


:laffo:
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Re: My annual rant

Postby cheapseats » Sun Nov 30, 2014 10:53 am

Kraftwerk had major chart success outside the US. But if you want US charts to matter more than influence, go ahead and put in green day and milli vanilli and take out SRV.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby cheapseats » Sun Nov 30, 2014 10:54 am

Cortez the Killer wrote:
cheapseats wrote:

Without Kraftwerk, electronic music - house, techno, electro never happens, hiphop is much different if it explodes at all.


are you trying to make people hate them?


I loled
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Re: My annual rant

Postby SLAYER666 » Tue Dec 16, 2014 7:47 am

Green Day, Joan Jett and some others are now in.

Green Day. Fucking Green Day. Wow.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby Hoosier Fan » Tue Dec 16, 2014 10:19 am

I <3 Joan Jett in a really sleazy and creepy way.

I saw her at the top rock club in Indy in the early '80's. My future brother-in-law was the manager and the fire marshall must have been there for the show is the only reason I can think that the club wasn't shut down. She played about a 10 minute version of I Love Rock 'n' Roll to close the show. People were crammed into every possible open space and we stood on our table for the last half hour. It was like a 1000 person primal scream.

Probably not the best concert I ever saw, but one of the most memorable.

Green fucking Day? Wow.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby cheapseats » Tue Dec 16, 2014 10:33 am

Confirm. She did a free show when I was at Miss State. Middle of a big field homecoming weekend. Every tattoo wearing biker for 500 miles must have ridden in for the show and I jammed right up to the stage and stared at her from 15 feet away for one of the most primal, badass shows I've ever seen.

Image

She ruined me for all other women for years.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby juansamuel » Tue Dec 16, 2014 11:31 am

SLAYER666 wrote:.

Green Day. Fucking Green Day. Wow.



burn it down
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Re: My annual rant

Postby elprof » Tue Dec 16, 2014 12:40 pm

I just want it to be the Hall of Music I Like.
Virtually everything GOP critics have told us would follow from the policies put in place has not come to pass. You would think that this would occasion a few mea culpas, some rethinking, an admission of poor prognostication. But, alas, it continues.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby Hoosier Fan » Tue Dec 16, 2014 1:16 pm

elprof wrote:I just want it to be the Hall of Music I Like.


That would be awesome, but it still wouldn't get me to go to Cleveland.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby chad kilroy » Tue Dec 16, 2014 2:49 pm

I'm starting to think The Smiths aren't getting in because Morrissey has pissed everyone, ever, off. He's a minor league jerk compared to Mick Jagger and Axel Rose and their bands are in so get over it.

I'll put up their 5 year body of work against anyone's.

Good to see Stevie Ray and Lou Reed get in.
I was here.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby Hoosier Fan » Tue Dec 16, 2014 3:15 pm

chad kilroy wrote:I'm starting to think The Smiths aren't getting in because Morrissey has pissed everyone, ever, off. He's a minor league jerk compared to Mick Jagger and Axel Rose and their bands are in so get over it.

I'll put up their 5 year body of work against anyone's.

Good to see Stevie Ray and Lou Reed get in.


Well, sorry, if you put it up against the Stones from '68-73 I think you'd lose. Throw in two epic tours while you're at it. And they had some pretty good years outside of that range also, too, as well.

Did G&R even HAVE a 5 year body of work? oyid
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Re: My annual rant

Postby elprof » Tue Dec 16, 2014 3:18 pm

Hoosier Fan wrote:
elprof wrote:I just want it to be the Hall of Music I Like.


That would be awesome, but it still wouldn't get me to go to Cleveland.


Me neither.
Virtually everything GOP critics have told us would follow from the policies put in place has not come to pass. You would think that this would occasion a few mea culpas, some rethinking, an admission of poor prognostication. But, alas, it continues.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby SLAYER666 » Tue Dec 16, 2014 3:50 pm

Hoosier Fan wrote:
Did G&R even HAVE a 5 year body of work? oyid


Barely. Same for Nirvana.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby cheapseats » Tue Dec 16, 2014 9:25 pm

Influence matters. GNR was big, nirvana's bigger. And if you have to be as influential as stones to get in they can buy a smaller building.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby cheapseats » Tue Dec 16, 2014 9:26 pm

elprof wrote:I just want it to be the Hall of Music I Like.


Indeed. Just see your own comments about Kraftwerk.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby elprof » Tue Dec 16, 2014 9:59 pm

cheapseats wrote:
elprof wrote:I just want it to be the Hall of Music I Like.


Indeed. Just see your own comments about Kraftwerk.


Why don't you see them and tell me the ones that say they should or should not be in the HOF?
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Re: My annual rant

Postby cheapseats » Wed Dec 17, 2014 4:17 pm

elprof wrote:
cheapseats wrote:
elprof wrote:I just want it to be the Hall of Music I Like.


Indeed. Just see your own comments about Kraftwerk.


Why don't you see them and tell me the ones that say they should or should not be in the HOF?


sorry, you're right. your opinion was their music, not whether they should be in.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby Hoosier Fan » Tue Mar 03, 2015 8:31 pm

cheapseats wrote:Everything is based on the assumption that the HoF is a popular music hall of fame that includes dance, blues, jazz and rap.

The Paul Butterfield Blues Band - no. The HoF probably doesn't need too many harmonica players, a white one who also did fusion jazz probably doesn't need to be one of them.
Chic - yes. Nile Rodgers should be in the Hall. Don't really care how you make that happen.
Green Day - no. pop punk doesn't need a representative even if they have had a good career and some solid songs
Joan Jett & the Blackhearts - yes. though I'd probably go with the runaways instead so you get Lita Ford as well.
Kraftwerk - yes. one of the 5 most influential musical groups of all time. embarrassing that they're not in.
The Marvelettes - duh. already have the Supremes, Martha and the Vandellas, the Shirelles, the Ronettes. Is there a requirement to add a motown girl group every 5 years?
N.W.A - yes. but where the fuck is bambataa?
Nine Inch Nails - tweener. tough call. reznor mainstreamed industrial, but skinny puppy, ministry & KMFDM were all there first and throbbing gristle was their grandaddy.
Lou Reed - duh. if they had any sense they'd backdate this one and pretend that he's been there since 1990
The Smiths - tweener. some great albums and hugely influential, but only if the induction ceremony features johhny marr sitting in with warlock pinchers playing morrisey rides a cockhorse. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z20UYhP8vIQ
The Spinners - no. see marvelettes and substitute the 3 times longer list of all male groups
Sting - no. the police made reggae safe for white people and he did the same with jazz as a solo artist. hell of a musician though.
Stevie Ray Vaughan - duh. See Lou Reed, multiply by 1000.
War - yes. the merger of jazz, funk, rock with musicians of ever race on the planet was unique and hugely influential
Bill Withers - yes. how is he not already there?


Cheaps took a lot of grief for his Kraftwerk comment.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/how-blondie ... ding_now_2

WSJ does an occasional feature where an artist talks about how a song was birthed. It's really a great feature even if you don't care about the song/artist.

ChrisSteinNotes:

"Mr. Stein: We loved the idea. As a band, we had already been referencing the electronic-dance feel of Kraftwerk, which released “Trans-Europe Express”
a year earlier. We felt that would be a move forward. But getting that sound back then was a mystery to all of us. It had to be invented.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby elprof » Tue Mar 03, 2015 9:07 pm

It's great that they influenced Blondie. I like lots of Blondie music.

But I haven't heard any Kraftwerk song I could tolerate for very long. And I've tried lots of them.

I'm still not convinced that they are one of the five most influential groups of all time.
Virtually everything GOP critics have told us would follow from the policies put in place has not come to pass. You would think that this would occasion a few mea culpas, some rethinking, an admission of poor prognostication. But, alas, it continues.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby Hoosier Fan » Tue Mar 03, 2015 10:29 pm

elprof wrote:It's great that they influenced Blondie. I like lots of Blondie music.

But I haven't heard any Kraftwerk song I could tolerate for very long. And I've tried lots of them.

I'm still not convinced that they are one of the five most influential groups of all time.


I know. My knowledge of Kraftwerk was limited to the fact that Autobahn was a hit while we were on Spring Break. Didn't bother me that much, especially late night/early morning as we drove straight through to and from Fort Lauderdale and some album rock stations would play the long version.

Safe to say they WERE more influential than HA recording himself falling down the steps.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby cheapseats » Tue Mar 03, 2015 10:57 pm

kraftwerk albums are more soundtracks for non-existent movies than collections of songs. Live, the do a lot of improvisation, which you wouldn't expect.
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Re: My annual rant

Postby Joe Sieve » Wed Mar 04, 2015 3:13 pm

cheapseats wrote:kraftwerk albums are more soundtracks for non-existent movies than collections of songs.


If you like that like that sort of thing, you might like these guys. IMO, infinitely more listenable than that Sprockets sound of Kraftwerk:

https://play.spotify.com/album/159ORixBSSemxiualv1Woj

https://play.spotify.com/album/0wBiN0fKhy0ywx732SpgUs

https://play.spotify.com/album/7Lou3RDk6NswmbzBMhro24
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Re: My annual rant

Postby cheapseats » Wed Mar 04, 2015 7:30 pm

I'm quite fond of Boards of Canada and similar trip-hop/ambient stuff like Future sounds of london, Orbital, aphex twin, kruder and dorfmeister or thievery corporation. I hate the name intelligent dance music (IDM) that some people tried to apply to all that, tend to just call it all downtempo and ignore people who need micro-genre niches.

Also fond of the older similar stuff from brian eno, tangerine dream and the classical minimalism of John Adams and Philip Glass.

More listenable? I guess, but I've been listening to kraftwerk since forever, so it's all very familiar to me, which I'm sure makes a difference.
then again, I'll happily crank Green Day's Dookie to 11 and holler along, even if I don't think they should be in the HoF. so what do I know?
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